Help with a tank (vehicle) and its weapons

[AmazingFlightLizard]

Soooo hi. First post and all, here, but I've lurked on and off for a couple years.

Soon after I got back from Afghanistan, to my home of Tampa, Florida, I made myself a purchase. Remember that old game at the fair, Tank Tag (or something similar depending on what fair you went to, I guess) that had the tank with the driver and gunner? The tank shot racquetballs and much fun could be had.

Yeah, well I got one.

Trouble is, it doesn't run so well. And the awesome gun that shoots racquetballs? Well, it doesn't. Not anymore at least. It should, but there's something wrong with it. Just like the drive system. It should run, the motor is in good shape, but it just pokes along, when it runs at all.

Now I'm a pretty decent helicopter mechanic and tinkerer in general, but this thing has me totally stumped. I guess I'm looking for maybe help from anyone that lives not too far from me, or even online help, if possible.

I've more or less gutted the inside with the aim of putting another one or two people inside. The intention being the 3rd person would operate a GoPro I'm going to place on top of the tank, hopefully with a gimbal to swivel it around. And maybe even the 4th person to operate a pair of AR.Drones I have (not at the same time, obviously) to give me an overhead view of the battlefield.

I've got an airsoft coax gun next to the main gun that did serve faithfully for the one game I had the tank in, but its sat out in the elements for a while.
I'm wanting to get back the functionality of the main gun for shooting racquetballs, and to maybe use a vortex gun as the coax. It seems a few people wanted to run up on the tank and not call their hits when it was just an airsoft gun strapped to it for the coax. I think a vortex gun may make them rethink their cunning plans.


So these are huge, grand plans with a not unlimited budget, and a somewhat limited technical knowledge. Anybody? Maybe?

[jrrdw]

This "tank tag" seems to be exclusive to South Florida fair. Is the tank made by Midway? Im guessing the tank is driven by electric motor powered by batteries? Have you checked the obvious...batteries (under a load), wire harneses, plug connections, so on so fourth. Upload some pictures if you can. Any ID numbers on the tank?

Welcome to Spudfiles.

[jackssmirkingrevenge]

I would suggest for you main gun looking into a commercial QEV setup with a three-way valve as a pilot/refill valve, everything you need to know here: http://www.spudfiles.com/how-to-databas ... 23626.html

You can make a breech loading mechanism very simply by cutting a hole in the barrel and putting a sleeve over it, something likethis golf ball launcher:





As to the co-ax vortex, rate of fire is far beyond what a normal airsoft gun will put out, so make sure you keep pressures low for the sake of safety! I would also use a 1/4" barrel and the crappiest 0.12gram BBs you can find, keeps costs down and danger low so what if they are unpolished and have seams, they won't jam in a looser barrel and if you are hosing someone down, who cares about accuracy

[AmazingFlightLizard]

It's actually powered by a Honda zero turn radius mower engine with some crazy hydraulic drive system. I was about to step outside and take pictures but it started pouring. That's okay, I can wait ten minutes and take some more.

Thanks for the welcome. I think I can easily place a vortex gun in the turret, I'm just limited by room, and I'd like to be able to cram a larger than average amount of BBs in there, right next to the main gun. There is room to put a large-ish tank (maybe a scuba tank if I can find one cheap enough) as an air source for the vortex gun, but I'd like to use something smaller. The main gun actually has an air compressor fed by the engine, and an electrical switch that allows for the circuit to complete and the gun to fire. That part is pretty awesome, I just think right now with it I have some kind of plumbing issue. There seems to be a blockage in the lines.

I have some old pictures here that show the general appearance:

[AmazingFlightLizard]

I would suggest for you main gun looking into a commercial QEV setup with a three-way valve as a pilot/refill valve, everything you need to know here: http://www.spudfiles.com/how-to-databas ... 23626.html

You can make a breech loading mechanism very simply by cutting a hole in the barrel and putting a sleeve over it, something likethis golf ball launcher:





As to the co-ax vortex, rate of fire is far beyond what a normal airsoft gun will put out, so make sure you keep pressures low for the sake of safety! I would also use a 1/4" barrel and the crappiest 0.12gram BBs you can find, keeps costs down and danger low so what if they are unpolished and have seams, they won't jam in a looser barrel and if you are hosing someone down, who cares about accuracy

Thanks for that, but the main gun is already in there, and SHOULD work pretty awesomely once I figure out what is going on with the air line. I'm not planning on shooting the racquetballs at people. That is planned for other vehicles. The impending vortex gun is my people-eater.
Again, I can work miracles on a helicopter. This thing just seems to totally elude me. It is no kind of easy to figure out, though. Not for me, at least. I'm sure it would be simple enough for some of you folks.

[jrrdw]

It's actually powered by a Honda zero turn radius mower engine with some crazy hydraulic drive system.

That's awesome! The builder probably used the entire drive system from the mower. Does it steer by 2 sticks? Chances are the carburetor is gunked up from sitting without being run. It could just be a condensation bubble formed in the gas bowl that will need drained to a full carb cleaning is needed. Not a big deal either way just take a good look at where the linkages are connected in case a simple bowl draining doesn't cure the problem. Also make sure it has good clean fuel in it.

You're in luck, I'm a mechanic and own a lawnmower repair business. :bigsmurf:

[AmazingFlightLizard]

It's actually powered by a Honda zero turn radius mower engine with some crazy hydraulic drive system.

That's awesome! The builder probably used the entire drive system from the mower. Does it steer by 2 sticks? Chances are the carburetor is gunked up from sitting without being run. It could just be a condensation bubble formed in the gas bowl that will need drained to a full carb cleaning is needed. Not a big deal either way just take a good look at where the linkages are connected in case a simple bowl draining doesn't cure the problem. Also make sure it has good clean fuel in it.

You're in luck, I'm a mechanic and own a lawnmower repair business. :bigsmurf:

Well, close, but no cigar. It drives by a steering wheel and this pedal that is sorta like a seesaw, push the right side for fwd, the left for rev. And the motor is MORE OR LESS good. I've run it before, plenty. The battery craps out though. I gotta get a new one. It's got an alternator bolted to it that looks like one off any ole little car. On that belt is also the air compressor.



The big problem, I think, is in the hydraulics. I don't suppose you live anywhere near Tampa, Florida, and can give it a once-over? Even if not, I expect to pick your brain quite a bit about small stuff if you'll have it. This thing needs a mechanical brain bigger than mine. I'm sure the motor could run better or more efficient, but it seems to be doing okay for now. So again, the problem is hydraulics, and the air line for the main gun. I was told there may be water or something in the line, which would completely stop the air, somehow, I guess, and I need a cheap little water separator for it too.

The plan is to get all that fixed. The turret sits up about an inch or so too high, so it doesn't sit snug on the turret ring, and sometimes sticks when you turn it. That should HOPEFULLY be a small fix. Even if ai have to completely pull it off and reseat it, I don't care.

The aim is to have this thing full up and running the way it's supposed to, by December-ish time (I wouldn't mind sooner rather than later though just for fun's sake) as there is a big game around then. I've invested a bit of money in this thing, I'd like it to not be a turd anymore.

[jrrdw]

I live in Maryland, wanna drag it that far? L0L In order for me to be able to help you with this I need to know exactly what it is. Engine model and code numbers and what exact hydrolic units it has. Have you changed the hydrolic filter/s? It may have a screw on canister type or screens in the top of the pump/s.

Are the pump/s and motors seperate?

[AmazingFlightLizard]

Hmmm. I can get you the numbers pretty easy. I actually had them at one point and forgot. I remember it's a 12 hp zero turn radius mower. Actual model numbers, I'll have to get later.

All the other stuff?

Hmm. Yeah. Uh huh. I know what some of those words mean.

I may have to walk through it slowly with you and take a buttload of pictures.

[jrrdw]

Yes pictures all the way!

[AmazingFlightLizard]

Well, seeing as it's at the GF's parents' place right now, I'll send some of what I got, and get you updated ones the next time I'm out there.

[jrrdw]

I've more or less gutted the inside with the aim of putting another one or two people inside.

Since you did this you will want to check for some things like did you kink a line, undo a fastener that allowed any changes you are not immeditly aware of. Stranger things have happened.

Question: Was it running good before you 'gutted' it'?

Trouble shooting 101: Isolate the systems and test them 1 at a time. For example, take the belt off and start the engine. There should be a slight increase in the preformance but not night and day differance. If there is a big differance what ever the belt is driving has issues. Jack up the drive wheels and place a brick on the pedal to hold the valve open then spin the drive wheels by hand. Is it hard as hell to turn the wheel entire time or just to get it started then turn smoothly? (do this with the belt off)

Do you hear a banging/chattering when you start it and or when you step on the drive pedal? That would be air bound hydrolic lines and can cause problems like sluggishness, hesitation...

Is the hydrolic oil tank attached to the drive motors or is there a tank with lines feeding the pump/s? Any leaks anywhere on anything? Fix any and all of those 1st off.

[AmazingFlightLizard]

Well, the only thing that was actually gutted was a lot of excess fiberglass and stuff that got in the way. Nothing at all mechanical. I'm not so dumb as to snatch out parts without knowing what they go to.

When I have the battery charged enough to give it electrical power, it runs fine. A little sputters at first but I'm sure there was water in the fuel line. I put an additive in the fuel tank for storage and to hopefully get rid of most of the water. The tank is mostly full, because I'm hoping to avoid any buildup of condensation inside it. The hydraulic tank is pretty well full. There were some leaks, but I THINK we got them all. I'm still not certain though. It's not dripping any fluid from what I can tell, but again, not sure.

The lines feed into what looks like some kind of gearbox between both rear wheels. I ASSUME this is where a lot of the magic happens.

I think the motor is generally okay, mechanically. It's all this weird hydraulic drive stuff that's got me baffled.

Also, I know I'm getting ahead of myself here, but any idea where to go with keeping the back end of the coax gun compact, but still able to fit a decent amount of BBs? Mostly I can't have it extend too far back into the turret, because the gunner won't have much room. I CAN have it extend up or down a ways that, maybe at a 90° angle or so. Weather has been pretty awful here lately, so no pictures, but I'll head out there in the next couple days to give you guys a much better idea of what's up with it.

[jrrdw]

Is the altanator working? Start it up then take the posative cable off the battery, if it keeps running it's charging. Is something draining the battery while it's sitting? Use a 12 volt test light and clamp the grounding wire to the negitive post on the battery and touch the pointy probe to the frame, (poke it to the bare metal) and if the light lights up there is a drain. If not turn something on and test the magjic.

[AmazingFlightLizard]

Is the altanator working? Start it up then take the posative cable off the battery, if it keeps running it's charging. Is something draining the battery while it's sitting? Use a 12 volt test light and clamp the grounding wire to the negitive post on the battery and touch the pointy probe to the frame, (poke it to the bare metal) and if the light lights up there is a drain. If not turn something on and test the magjic.

That's a really good call, Ill give that a shot. I dunno if the battery just isn't holding a charge or if the alternator crapped out, but it seems this is the kinda thing that would determine that. I've gotten it started plenty, and then it shut off. Usually would keep running for a while. I suppose I could even maybe tighten up the belt somehow, it's seemed real loose last time I messed with it.

Wish I knew someone local who knew what they were doing with it. I was thinking about checking with a local lawnmower shop, but this thing may be so far out of left field they don't know what to do with it. Much less would they cut me a break on cost. I'm not exactly overflowing with money, but dammit, I want this thing running. It's got so much potential.